Note: at this time transcripts are automated and unedited, which means errors may occur. But we hope you find them helpful!

[00:00:00] Viv: Welcome back to another episode of marketing without social media. Now, before we dive in, I wanted to let you know that if you are a service based business, thank coaches consultants, therapists who wants to get to $7,000 plus recurring months. Yes. Every month, but needs help with growing your audience.

[00:00:18] Maybe with generating regular leads or landing paying clients, then I’d like to invite you to a free. 15 minute leads, game plan call. Yes, just 15 minutes to work on your marketing plan.

[00:00:33] Sophie: This is a super fast pace call. And

[00:00:35] Viv: in this call, we are gonna take a look at your current situation to see what is, and isn’t working for you right now in your business.

[00:00:41] We’re gonna figure out and identify what’s possible for you and your business in the next six months and beyond we’re gonna uncover the number one. That is restricting your growth and holding you back right now. And finally, we are gonna develop a three step action plan. [00:01:00] Yes, three step action plan that will get you results in your business.

[00:01:04] A S P. Now the session is. Free it’s 15 minutes. And all you have to do is head on over to Viv guide.com/game plan. Yes, that’s Viv guide.com/game plan. Right now, pick a day, pick a time that suits you and let’s chat. You might be thinking that you’ve entered some sort of alternate reality with today’s episode, but you have not.

[00:01:32] I assure you. So today I have Sophie Griffith here with me who is a Facebook ads manager and social media expert with over 10 years experience in this field. And you might think, but. Viv. This is a podcast, all about marketing without social media. So why is Sophie here today? Well, for me, I wanted to bring someone on because there is so much info [00:02:00] out there pushing social media as the holy grail of lead generation.

[00:02:06] And it’s a. Big issue and a big misconception that you have to be on social media and then investing in paid ads to grow your business. Now, when I connected with Sophie, it was so refreshing to hear her transparency, um, that. And, you know, a not so rose tinted view of how effective Facebook ads and social media are for lead generation and audience growth for small businesses.

[00:02:33] And that’s why I really wanted Sophie to come on this episode in this episode, covering the impact and the effectiveness of social media ads for small businesses, the opportunities and the benefits of using ads to support your organic marketing and lead generation. Thirdly, we’re gonna be talking about ways to use ads without being active on social media, which is obviously what we’re [00:03:00] all about here on marketing without social media, and finally how much you need to invest for your ads to be effective.

[00:03:08] If that’s the route you want to go down. And finally how much you now need to look at investing as a small business for your ads to be effective since the iOS changes that came into force in 2021. So grab a pen and paper, cuz you are going to want to take notes on this episode. Enjoy.

[00:03:38] You’re listening to marketing without social media. With me Viv guy, the podcast for people who want more clarity, connections, and cash in their business, I’ll be sharing with you proven techniques from leading onto entrepreneurs. And experts from across the globe to help you to market without social media and to grow your [00:04:00] business in a way that actually feels good to you.

[00:04:12] Sophie welcome to the show. I’m so excited to have a fellow podcaster

[00:04:18] Sophie: here with me today. I do. I’m so excited. Thank you for having me. This is actually on my first few interviews on other people shows so exciting. Exciting,

[00:04:28] Viv: right? Okay. So. In the intro I’ve, I’ve mentioned to people that this is not the ordinary type of episode for marketing without social media, because , you’re digital marketing strategies.

[00:04:42] Okay. And you are I, well, to me, a Facebook ads. Expert. Yeah. Yeah. I’m manager, I guess aren’t you as Facebook ads manager for people, small businesses. So bit of a difference sort of theme today on the episode. So the reason, obviously I’ve got you on because we’re in a [00:05:00] group together and you really peaked my interest when you were talking about small businesses and how ads are just not as effective for them as they.

[00:05:11] Maybe 12 months ago and beyond. So I wanted to get you on to talk about this because I think there’s still a lot of misinformation out there in the world, you know, in the online space saying Facebook ads are still the miracle, you know? Yeah. Solution golden bullet, golden bullet. They are the answer to your, your lead generation issues.

[00:05:32] And that’s not the case anymore. Is it? So that’s one of the things I wanted to talk to you about. So before we get started, You know, one of the questions I, I asked you just before we, we hit the record was can you qualify what you mean in. Sense of talking about Facebook ads by a small business. What do you mean by a small business in this, this sense?

[00:05:54] Cause we’re gonna talk small business today and that’s kind of the context we’re we’re discussing.

[00:05:59] Sophie: Yeah. [00:06:00] So small business in terms of Facebook ads would be and more about how much you’re spending rather than the actual size of your business. And I have clients that spend anything from like a couple of hundred pounds a month through to maybe 3,005,000 pounds a month.

[00:06:14] And that is all guarded like small business just to. But in context. Cause sometimes I think it’s helpful and it still blows my mind a little bit. You will have like companies are spending like 10, 20, 50,000 pounds a day on Facebook ads. Uh, and even more so like brown Christmas or black Friday or that sort of thing.

[00:06:32] So yeah. Multimillion pound Facebook ads, budgets are. Are a thing then they’re definitely big businesses. So I know it sounds like when we are talking about small businesses and people like own our own businesses, it sounds like, oh my God, 5,000, 10,000 pounds a month on ads is huge. But when do you put in context?

[00:06:48] That’s still very much like small business in Facebook ads world.

[00:06:52] Viv: Wow. Okay. Okay. So talk to us about. What was the big changing point for the effectiveness [00:07:00] of Facebook ads that came in last year?

[00:07:02] Sophie: Yeah. So last year you might have heard something about the iOS 14 update and essentially it’s where apple decided they were gonna make some changes to privacy and they rolled out an update, iOS 14 and they.

[00:07:15] Prompted or automatically changed depending on which type of vote you had basically ask people. Do you want apps to track your activity now? I would say most people when faced with that kind of question, you’re gonna say no, I don’t want anyone to track my activity. Thank you very much. And I think the stats is something like 80 something percent of people opted out to being track.

[00:07:38] I’m gonna guess that the other, that people were probably Facebook ads managers, desperately trying to to keep some data. And essentially what it means is before the update, when you went onto a website and you looked at the website, the web, there’s a thing called a pixel, which a website has on it, which you connects your website to Facebook ads and the pixel tracks your [00:08:00] data anonymous.

[00:08:01] And says nothing doesn’t record any of your data, but it tracks that you’ve been there and it logs kind of information about what you’ve done. So whether you’ve viewed the page, looked at a product, added something to cart or made a purchase. And then when you, if you didn’t purchase, for example, and you moved onto another website, you might notice that you then start getting what we call re-targeting ads, where someone said, if someone goes to my website, I want to give them an ad that then like basically follows them around the internet until they come back and buy the thing that I offer.

[00:08:30] So using data like that was really, really helpful for Facebook ad strategists, essentially. And what happened with the update is alone. Everyone opted out of being tracked. It means that when someone goes onto the website, we get far less data to work with. So we can’t necessarily see exactly what you’ve done.

[00:08:48] Some data is completely blocked. Facebook are coming up with workarounds. They’re trying to kind of use this, another technique called conversion API, where we can track some different data in the background, [00:09:00] but essentially there’s a bit of a black hole of data and it’s making it really hard for Facebook ads, managers, and businesses to actually work out what’s working.

[00:09:10] What’s not working and what people are doing. What people are doing. So it’s, yeah, it’s been challenging and there’s different strategies that we can play around with. But a lot of small businesses have seen a, really, a really big drop in that ads, performance. And it’s mean that we have to look at kind of different techniques alongside the ads as

[00:09:29] Viv: well.

[00:09:30] Ooh, interesting. Not so magic

[00:09:34] Sophie: anymore. No, not so magic anymore. And it definitely was the case. And I would say as well, this is probably coincided. As well, I think the impact is maybe being increased because of, you know, the COVID years where everyone was at home, everyone was buying things online.

[00:09:49] Everything was really set up for online, small businesses. Like it, it really was like a very difficult time for a lot of people, but for small, especially econ businesses, it was a really [00:10:00] good time to be online. And as we’re working really, really. Um, and then as we sort of were allowed to like get back out into the wild and then the iOS 14 thing came in and then we had, you know, living CRI, you know, cost of living crisis with the war so much is going on.

[00:10:18] Um, not only is it harder for people to convince harder for businesses to convince people to. Straight off the bat. You know, if you see an ad now, maybe if you were sitting at home with COVID and you see an ad on Facebook and you think, oh yeah, what the hell? Like I’m gonna buy that. That’ll make me feel better.

[00:10:35] Now you might be thinking, I do not have the spare money for that. I’m only gonna buy something when I, you know, for a gift or for a much more of a special occasion. So I think it’s probably a combination of things, which is where we have. Use multiple strategies again

[00:10:51] Viv: and not just rely on ads.

[00:10:52] Interesting. Yeah. I know actually, quite a lot of people in COVID were saving so much money, not commuting and things, you know, and, uh, [00:11:00] yeah, just boredom

[00:11:01] Sophie: buying, I guess. Yeah. And like doing up the house, but if we’re gonna be here for the next three months, we might as well do the house up and

[00:11:08] Viv: that we live next to a turf company.

[00:11:10] And I think in like the first month of lockdown, they made like over a million pounds, they were like, oh my God, time over. Yeah. Cause they could provide turf and things. And we were like, oh yep. Well, you know, can’t argue you that, can you cause everyone? No, exactly. And they said, we put, we, we tripled our prices because there was so much demand.

[00:11:26] Yeah. Try and slow demand and people just kept paying it. So they’ve never put the prices down, you know? Well,

[00:11:31] Sophie: exactly. That’s that now we had, um, I think it was garden furniture was like, we were trying to get hold of some and it was like 12 week wait or something insane. Like yeah. Some things did incredibly well during COVID.

[00:11:44] Viv: Yeah. Yeah. And yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Okay. So. Obviously, you know, it’s not the golden bullet anymore. Okay. So you’ve talked about, you need to combine ads with other strategies. So talk to us about what other strategies and we talk about alternate strategies to [00:12:00] social media. Yeah. We don’t talk a lot about paid ads on here cuz we talk, you know, mainly about organic, uh, uh, marketing.

[00:12:06] So this is why it’s really interesting to bring in the paid ads, but talk to us about the other strategies that we can bring in alongside. If we wanted to invest in paid.

[00:12:16] Sophie: Yeah. So I think the key with the paid ads that they do still do quite well, is it gets you in front of a new audience. Mm-hmm and you know, it can, if you have got small budget, you can get in front of people with quite a good degree of accuracy in terms of their interests, where they live, you know, really, depending on what you do, like if you want to get in front of a local audience that live within.

[00:12:36] 30 miles of you, Facebook is incredibly effective at doing that. Um, and it might be that for a short time, you want to advertise an offer to a local surroundings, or it might be a type of interest that people have. And actually it’s very good way of doing that. And the combination really is to make the most of your budget.

[00:12:57] Most of my clients now will combine ads with [00:13:00] getting email signups rather than going straight for purchase. So really it comes back. Having a really solid email strategy. And most of my clients, I talk to, we talk about getting these like foundational pieces in place about getting new people, bringing new people into the business.

[00:13:15] So how are you bringing new people in all the time? How are you nurturing them? And then how are you converting them to say, um, to buy from you? Uh, adds a really good at each of those points. But they’re not like the only one. So at the top, you’d be looking at other long form. I’m sure you’ve talked about all these things, you know, other long form pieces of content, like a podcast yes.

[00:13:32] Or, um, a YouTube channel or, um, a blog or, yeah, exactly. So all those sorts of things, um, which can be used in conjunction with ads because you could drive traffic to a blog. You could drive, um, traffic to sign up to your email list. You could drive traffic to listen to your podcast or watch your videos. Um, you could even use a video on Facebook to, um, capture people looking at it, and then you can retarget them with another ad for people who watch say over 50% of [00:14:00] your video to get them on your email list.

[00:14:02] So it’s kind of this ecosystem of kind of bringing people into your world and then like nurturing. You know, the next one down to like nurture them. You could, um, you could use ads to, um, share like valuable content with them, quite similar. Really. It’s just working through what types of thing you want to do at each level.

[00:14:20] And then really the push for sell. Depending really on what you do works really well for econ, uh, because you are, you can have people that’ve added to cart as a really strong signal that they’re interested in buying for service providers. I don’t tend to use the push to sell quite so much. I tend to use that offline with a, you know, call or webinar or whatever

[00:14:40] Viv: now, obviously.

[00:14:42] We talked before we, we hit recorder and he said, the big thing is, you know, the White’s hard for small businesses now is you need to be spending to do a lot more testing because of obviously the iOS 14 changes. Um, and that’s tricky for a lot of people who don’t really know [00:15:00] how to use ads. Does this is this where you see it becoming more prohibitive for, for small businesses now to invest because it’s not just investing in the ad spend, it’s having an ad manager, isn’t it to kind of manage that as well, because in, in the past, you know, historically pre iOS, you know, you could, could run a campaign on your own.

[00:15:19] Might not be as, as effective, obviously as if you with, with an ad manager, but you know, you could get results. Whereas I’m guessing now that’s that’s changed. Has that

[00:15:28] Sophie: changed? Yeah, definitely. And I think that’s where I’m a lot of, um, clients come to me, like I’ve been doing my own ads and it’s been doing fine and now they’re not doing very well and I don’t know what to do about it.

[00:15:40] Um, so some of the key issues that we have is that because of the data interruptions that Facebook now has, cause it just doesn’t get the data back. We have to wait seven to 10 days often to see. And often they can be backdated. So you might be running ads. I could go in today and check my ads and I say, have three purchases.

[00:15:57] I could go in two days later and three [00:16:00] purchases might have been attributed to today, but I didn’t, I won’t see them today. So it’s all about, um, knowing, being confident in your strategy and testing different things, but also waiting. And it’s that waiting game that people find so hard because we were talking about this earlier.

[00:16:14] Weren’t you, you don’t know. What you are doing is right. You don’t know that what you’re doing is gonna get results. So it’s really hard to keep the faith. When you are spending your money every single day on Facebook ads, you don’t know if they’re gonna deliver and it doesn’t look like they’re doing what they should be doing.

[00:16:31] Um, it’s really, really hard. And then, like you said, the other thing is the testing. So. So many different formats now, uh, it’s like Instagram and all it’s many different facets but you’ve got, um, story ads, real ads, image ads, carousel ads, in-app experience ads. Um, there’s so many different things that you can test.

[00:16:53] You wanna test different copy, different creative video versus still image. Like there are so many different things you want to test that, [00:17:00] um, you do have to have a bit of a chunky budget. To be able to do that relatively quickly. Um, because otherwise you are, if you kind of wait seven to 10 days to test one image and then do another seven to 10 days to test a video and then another seven to 10 days, by the time you’ve got three, four different ones, you’re gonna be end of the month and you need to start all over again.

[00:17:21] So yeah, it’s, that’s where it becomes really tricky, but it is much easier if you can see, um, Use the information you have about your customers. So the more information you have, um, the more data points you have for Facebook, the easier it is. And that’s why, like, literally the first thing I would say to any client is what’s your email list?

[00:17:41] Like, like, is it good? Is it big? How big is it? Is it active? Have you got good data? Because if we can feed that into Facebook and let’s say you run an ad to your email subscribers about a new product that you’re launching. That’s gonna, so whatever your open rate is, that’s gonna reach even more people on top of that open [00:18:00] rate and kind of keep that email list engaged.

[00:18:03] Yeah. Just like using the strategies together.

[00:18:06] Viv: Yeah. A lot of, uh, lot of people, a lot of our listers are maybe not at that stage where they’ve got a. Very large, you know? Yeah. So it’s not, you know, it’s not gonna help feed into that if they did wanna go down the Adro and it was really interesting, you know, as you said, we were talking before about this, keeping the faith, how to keep the faith in, in, in the things that you’re doing when you just don’t know, you know, is it the right thing?

[00:18:30] Will it get me the results? And, you know, I, I, I guess the thing here is, cause not having all your eggs in one basket, isn’t it, you know? Yeah. And of course we wanna focus on, you know, not spreading ourselves too thinly. But, you know, if it’s, if it’s around ads, what else are you doing to bring in leads? You know, if that’s, if that’s or, or to make sales, what other things have you got in place?

[00:18:50] You know, if it was around sort of income we were talking about earlier, aren’t we, um, do you have another income stream? Can you get another income stream? I, I remember one of my old [00:19:00] coaches saying what’s the worst that could happen. And when we worked out, we were like, well, I guess you just gotta go and get another.

[00:19:06] While you run your, and it’s not the ideal, but actually there’s always an answer. There’s always a solution so that, you know, you can kind of take away some of that, you know, how, how do you hold the faith? Keep going. Yeah. There is always something else that can be

[00:19:19] Sophie: done. Yeah, definitely. And I think that I probably wouldn’t advocate.

[00:19:23] Um, like if you’re primarily focusing on organic strategies, like your email and your blogs and your SEO and your podcasting and everything, I probably wouldn’t advocate necessarily to have ads on all the time. But if you’re at a point where you just need more leads and you need people who are relatively qualified to come into your world, to give you an opportunity to nurture them, ads are, are a tool that you can switch on and off.

[00:19:47] And it’s not that 90 day lead. That we were talking about there isn’t that kind of lag time of like, right. Whatever work I put in now is gonna take time. It’s a case of like, switch them on. You will start getting, let’s say [00:20:00] you, um, had some kind of blog or something on your website that you knew converted to people signing up to a sales call or whatever it is.

[00:20:08] Uh, maybe you were running a webinar and you want people on it. If you know that you’ve got sales page, that. Running ads for say, if you run ads for say two to three pounds a day through to, um, that page, you know, you could run it for 10 days, three weeks and just see how many more leads you get and how much they’re worth to you.

[00:20:29] Cause it might be that if you’re building up to, um, it might be that if you just need more leads, then it’s a good tool to use. But I wouldn’t necessarily say you’d want to be spending lots of money. All the.

[00:20:41] Viv: Yeah, absolutely. Something that someone raised with me the other day was she had dabbled with investing in Instagram ads.

[00:20:48] I think

[00:20:48] Sophie: it was mm-hmm um,

[00:20:50] Viv: and she said she brought in more leads. She had more people booking in calls with her, but her conversion rate. Went down [00:21:00] quite dramatically. Um, because obviously the people she was tending to get on sales calls with prior to that were people that had come in via referrals, word of mouth cause of the nature of what she does.

[00:21:11] So do you see, do you kind of. Hear that from clients that sometimes there is this correlation that yes, you can grow the email list, but the people coming on calls are not really necessarily ready to buy at that moment, especially with, within, you know, service based businesses.

[00:21:26] Sophie: Yeah. And I think that probably is an issue like.

[00:21:30] But I think it’s just a numbers game. Isn’t it like really is a case of you haven’t nurtured them. And I think it’s probably maybe something you’d want to think about when you, if you’re getting in people through ads, what email sequence do they get? Like, well, how are you nurturing them? How can you make sure that they know your ethos really quickly, your values?

[00:21:48] Like how do they know that you only work with, you know, businesses that are looking to earn X amount? You know? Like how can you qualify them quite quickly? So they. Whether they’re good or not. And I think part of it as well [00:22:00] will be in the ad. So when you are calling out people, you need to be, make sure that you are super clear about who you want on your list.

[00:22:07] It’s not just a case of, I want anyone on my email list. So I see quite a lot people doing, um, like lead magnets that maybe aren’t specific enough for the people that they’re looking for. They might be like a generic checklist or something that actually could apply to quite a lot of people. The more specific you can be in your copy and the lead mag.

[00:22:26] Or the page that you’re sending them to. I think the bed of the quality of the leads. Oh, well, that’s across the

[00:22:30] Viv: board for organic strategies as well. Isn’t it? You know, I see that. Exactly. So many people say I have been hammering it. I’ve been doing summits and bundles and blah, blah, blah. And I’m still getting, you know, podcast gets it.

[00:22:39] I’m still getting zero, like leads or I’m. Getting people in, but they don’t seem like the right people and they’re not getting on course. They’re not converting. And it’s usually because they’re not actually the right audience. You’ve not attracted the right people in. So yeah, doing that work. And I say to people just slow down, go down, you know, and really focus on these initial bits.

[00:22:58] Because if you can [00:23:00] nail like your clarity piece, your niche, you know, your, your lead magnet and get that right. Then actually, when you start looking to generate leads via paid ads or organically, you know, whatever means you will then get the results, you’ll get the right people who will then convert, you know, if you notice correctly.

[00:23:15] So, yeah, absolutely. So that goes across the board, uh, for, for, regardless of the strategy there at all. So Sophie tell us about, um, how we can still use ads. Um, if we are not actively posting on social media, cuz this is something obviously a lot of, uh, uh, my listeners and my clients still have a presence, you know, or a profile, but they don’t actually want to be active posting organic content.

[00:23:41] So I was under the impression that with, with paid. That if you’re not active on your profile of the ads aren’t as effective. Can you talk to us a bit more about if that’s a, you know, is that a myth? Is that true? What’s the

[00:23:53] Sophie: score. So, um, when you run ads, Facebook would like grade them in terms of, um, how like, Good.

[00:23:59] [00:24:00] They are for like various different, uh, metrics. One of the metrics is like looking at how, uh, engaged your account is. And it’s kind of more checking for like spam. Uh, like, so if you are like got no zero posts, but like thousand followers or whatever, then it’s not gonna work. But if you’ve got posts on your account, if you’ve got people following you, and if you’ve had engagement on your account, like you should be fine for me.

[00:24:21] I think the biggest thing is, um, If someone clicks on an ad and they see an ad they’ve never heard of you before. And they think, oh, that’s interesting. I might just check them out. They might click onto your profile and have a look and then say your last post was from quite a while ago. They might think, oh, maybe this person isn’t like in business anymore, or isn’t active, whatever.

[00:24:40] So really my advice would be to use your profile, like really well, look at your bio in Instagram, make sure people know that the best way to contact you is X or like, I tend to speak to people via Y like make sure that you direct them really clearly, um, use your highlights story highlights. As you could put, you could just do some [00:25:00] stories and just say like, Have one highlight that says, click here or start here or something and tell people how they can get in touch with you.

[00:25:06] The services that you offer. Um, Instagram I’ve recently introduced a new feature called pined post, which is your like first post is pinned. So if you’ve got any posts on your grid at all, that explain who you are, what you do, how people can get in touch with you, make sure that’s the one that’s pin. And that will be on the top left.

[00:25:25] And then also, I would just think about what your top nine. So if someone was to look at the top nine post on your grid, what does it tell them? Like, um, we’ve all got random posts on our grid. Haven’t we like memes or stuff that was happening at the time or whatever, make sure your top nine are working really hard for you.

[00:25:41] So if someone comes on and they’ve got no idea who you are and they’ve, they hit your Instagram, what do you want them to know? Like what do you want them to know about what you offer? I would say testimonials would be a really great shout, you know, like a nice visual to like nice testimonial, um, different services.

[00:25:57] You offer a bit about you make it [00:26:00] a bit personal, make sure there’s a picture of you. I think just making sure those top nine are working super hard so that even if you’re not active, On it, people are still kind of being led to the next step with you, um, rather than just kind

[00:26:12] of

[00:26:12] Viv: dropping off. And I think that that correlates with what I often, uh, teach and, and recommend people.

[00:26:18] When I say don’t use social media organically to grow your email list, cuz it’s really pants, you know, reach with the algorithm and things. Um, but if you. You know, to, to maintain your social media presence, but you, instead of having this whole hamster wheel of like churning out constant content, which is exhausting, you know?

[00:26:37] Yeah. Bring people into your email, listen to your, your funnel another way. And then if you wanna say, Hey, but come hang out with me on Instagram or Facebook or wherever or TikTok, cuz it is at the moment, you know, um, like, you know, here’s how you can connect with me and then you’re not a slave to having to post all the time.

[00:26:53] You know, it’s your shock window, you know, for people to kind of just check out. Kind of credibility and that you exist and dah, dah, [00:27:00] dah, you know, all of that stuff. But yeah, I, I mean, people will, I’m a stuck record on this and I always say, don’t, don’t rely on it for, for lead generation and growing your email list because you know, organically, as we know, it’s, it’s the pits

[00:27:13] Sophie: at the moment.

[00:27:13] Yeah. It really is. Yeah, it really is. Um, but yes, no, I totally agree. Like it, think of it as your shop window and just make sure it’s like all up to scratch and then you should be fine running.

[00:27:22] Viv: Brilliant. Sophie. Thank you so, so much, it’s been awesome having you today. And I loved that. We, you know, I never expected we’d have a Facebook.

[00:27:31] I know. I don’t feel like’s on your, I love it because you know, you’re kind of shining the light going. This is the reality actually. Yeah, absolutely. Um, so thank you so much. So Sophie, where can people connect with you where I know you’ve got your new podcast killers all

[00:27:46] Sophie: about that. I have I’ve podcast.

[00:27:50] It’s all about marketing strategies. It’s loads of different types. It’s me every week, talking about how you can integrate. Facebook ads, emails, social media, so that you don’t have to rely [00:28:00] on social media quite so much. Um, and then I also do interviews with other experts. We’ve got like PR uh, email marketing, um, influence marketing, all sorts of different things.

[00:28:11] So that’s called growing pains. Uh, and there is an episode every Monday and every Thursday. Because I was blossom for punishment.

[00:28:18] Viv: S she’s a hardcore podcast of folks. Oh my gosh. Twice a week.

[00:28:24] Sophie: I know, but I’m just doing a series. I’m gonna do a series of three months and then I’m gonna pause. Um, yes,

[00:28:30] Viv: love it.

[00:28:31] Where else can people connect with you? Uh, other than

[00:28:33] Sophie: the podcast or how can, well, I am over on Instagram. That is my main hub, um, which is at the underscore social underscore pod. Or you can go onto my website, which is the social pod of doco dot.

[00:28:45] Viv: Awesome. Thank you so much, Sophie, for being here today, you’ve been a great guest and it’s been so nice to properly connect

[00:28:51] Sophie: with you cause we’re absolutely I’ve great time.

[00:28:53] We’re a great, great program together. And we were just

[00:28:54] Viv: say, but we feel like we don’t get to actually speak very much cause we times and stuff. So yet it’s been [00:29:00] so good to connect with you. Thank you very much.

[00:29:02] Sophie: Thank so much. So there you

[00:29:04] Viv: have it folks. I hope you’ve enjoyed this episode of marketing without social media today and feel inspired to take action in your business, whatever that looks like for you.

[00:29:17] And as always, thank you. Thank you. Thank you for tuning into another episode of this podcast. And if you haven’t done so already, please do subscribe to the podcast. So you don’t miss an episode, speak to you soon.